125 thoughts on “Fansub Review: [Vivid] Durarara!!x2 Shou (Episode 02)”

1. The show’s boring anyway.

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   • You’re boring. The show is great.

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     • I’ve tried no fewer than 5 times to watch the first series and I’ve never made it past episode 9. On most occasions I think I gave up at around episode 4.

       I think the problem is that to me there’s no clear conflict or apparent group loyalties or any kind of reasoning behind what happens. The characters do and react to stuff that’s kind of interesting, but without knowing any of their motivation, it’s really hard to care.

       It’s possible that I’ve just missed something and didn’t watch it closely enough, but mehhh.

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     • The slow pacing and the lack of interesting things happening pairs with a bad soundtrack for the rise of a truly boring show.
       Good enough, the show is still unique and didn’t manage to put himself into the category of “bad”, but that doesn’t mean it’s good.

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       • :/

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       • nice b8 bro, Durarara!!’s soundtrack is one of the best of any anime up to this day (I mean that in the most objective way imaginable)

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         • I’m talking about background music- they just make the show even more boring with the childish rhythm.

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           • I’m talking about the BGM as well. I think Makoto Yoshimori’s music, with inspiration from classical impressionism and romanticism, klezmer, Irish folk, and jazz genres like bebop, fit the series perfectly. Calling it “bad” or “childish” is a great insult to such a talented composer, with advanced works of high quality in such a large range of genres. But to each their own, I guess.

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             • The good thing is that it serves as lullaby.

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               • https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmY7uPr4Z3k
                 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEdLvO1XZOE
                 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE5UBdEATN8
                 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jOLebp9Rb0
                 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq51LRyGIVc

                 If any of these is your perception of a lullaby, then sure. (Still great compositions, though)

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       • Slow pacing? The dialogue and scene transitions are jacked up to 11 in order to cover the novels faster. What do you want each scene to be composed of, a character shouting their intentions for five seconds followed by a random cut to the next scene?

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         • Just something that doesn’t make me yawn.

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           • Ah, I was unaware that you finding a show boring magically changed its pacing and structure. I must have watched it before you since I didn’t feel reality bend as soon as you realized you were bored.

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2. I don’t know why but I can’t stop laughing at their use of “yay”.
   The second one he just says “ya”, bet Vivid was like “yeah, they just forgot to say the “y”, we’ll fix that for them”.
   Vivid: saving anime one letter at a time.
   Where the hell does it come from in the third one though?

   Spoiler for

   Is this a meme in the making?

   At least in the first one I guess it sounds close enough and within the context it could work but it’s still really annoying when groups don’t get these right, like when a character says “mhm” and the subs say “okay”, so damn stupid.

   And that chatlog TS, that’s a lot of screenshots for nothing at all, guess you got the point across though.

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   • http://ask.fm/Xythar/answer/124272608376
     http://ask.fm/Xythar/answer/124274770296

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     • Wasn’t really complaining or anything but ok.
       Also, there’s some pretty funny stuff there:
       http://ask.fm/herkzz/answer/123366413155
       Good stuff.

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       • If I ever get desperate enough for attention that I make an Ask FM, remind me to kill myself.

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         • friendly reminder?

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           • We’ve already been over this in the last OT, when I was asked to make one — which I only did because it’s an anonymous way of asking me questions (Crymore comments are only anonymous to a certain point, since I can see IPs, emails, websites, etc.). And the only way you can even find the thing is if you’re looking at the OT anyway.

             Honestly, I hate all of social media, but I make exceptions based upon request. I only have a Twitter because people wanted an alternate way to receive site updates than an RSS Feed. Same for Facebook and Tumblr.

             I hate making these compromises, but I will suck up my pride if it involves improving my readers’ experience somehow.

             tl;dr: Will kill myself, but never said when.

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             • http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=manly_suicide

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             • Yeah fair enough. These things have their use cases and probably started with good intentions, but as usual the userbase made them to what they are today.

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     • So the reason was “we’re lazy”
       At least he’s honest about it

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     • Yeah, hard to spin it any other way than laziness. There are many shows you can get away with this in, where signs are not a pivotal plot point. But in a show like this, they are simply avoiding the hardest part. It’s like baking a cake and not putting the icing on it because it’s too hard to do and it’s sweet enough anyway.

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       • Kek, just like how Coalgirls TSed all the text messages from S1, right?

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         • Coalgirls didn’t TS anything, they’re a BD group.

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           • lol

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           • Kristen still likes to mention the great effort and love they put in each release. If TS was lacking, couldn’t they have fixed it? Too much effort I guess.

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         • I didn’t do S1, nor do I even claim to have watched it. Please talk to Cyras about it if you have a problem.

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       • So then what about every single one of your shows besides Bakemonogatari that has bad TS? Is that just laziness on your part?

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         • I don’t recall the last show I did that has bad TS. You’re free to mention it if you want.

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           • Your hatred of blur in all your shows is just a sign of laziness. Between your 720p and 1080p of Nisekoi you never changed any of the blur for the signs. And your HxH title signs aren’t even blurred at all.

             It’s just a sign of how little you care.

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             • HxH isn’t my show.

               Nisekoi, yes, I didn’t, because there was hardly a need to. You could call it laziness if you want to, but I honestly only ever care about the 720p product, as that is what I’d watch and download. Not to mention 1080p is usually an upscale. 1080p is only offered as an extra because sometimes people want it.

               Regardless, I don’t think you can put modifying blur on the same level as ignoring the biggest challenge of subbing a series due to laziness.

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               • So your mistakes never matter, basically?

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                 • Well, seeing how you’ve already made up your mind and I can’t convince you otherwise, sure. Believe whatever you want and ignore what I write completely.

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                   • It’s like we’re in bizzaro crymore.

3. >If you can work the Japanese script’s Engrish into your release, do it, but only if you don’t have to ruin the scene in the progress.
   >in the progress.

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   • thatsthejoke.jpg

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     • Er, I think your attempt to embed an image failed there…

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4. >excited voice
   Yay!

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5. Wish people had chosen a show done by several groups. Something like Saekano.

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   • Why are you even watching that, anyway?
     Koufuku Graffiti needs more love though.

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     • I don’t know. It’s one of those “I’m bored, so I may as well” shows.

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6. inb4 Xythar’s mental gymnastics explaining the lack of TS

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7. I would really prefer vivid, but horriblesubs is just faster and I can get by with it so I just take theirs.
   I like the show so much that I can’t wait for a day or 2 more. I’d die.

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8. “So why is this the most-requested show on the poll?” waiting on this review to be perfectly honest. 7701 now for Vivid.

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9. I don’t give a shit about chatlog TS and neither should you, reader of this post, because the lines are (mostly?) spoken and as a result they’ll be in the subtitles anyway. TSing that would be a huge waste of time for no real reason since people would be reading the subtitles instead of the signs anyway.

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   • “a huge waste of time for no real reason”
     Like subbing a simulcasted show?

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     • Ganbare with your lack of OP/ED lyrics and pleb tier typesetting.

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       • Those are not necessary, just like TSing those signs. I don’t see why half-ass something that you didn’t even had to in the first place.

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10. >tonight™

    It seems the more caffeine I ingest, the more I feel like sleeping. This probably isn’t healthy, but it shikatabehelped. :<

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    • >shikatabehelped
      I swear you have a new variation on that every time.

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11. You do realise that what you’ve got here is basically a popularity poll, not a hardest-choice-to-make poll?

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12. http://ask.fm/Xythar/answer/124272608376

    If it’s any consolation I’m timing the chat logs’ dialogue sorta like they are signs.

    Also anything Celty writes on her pad is also “said” so once again, pretty redundant if you ask me.

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13. I miss the good old SGKK releases of S1 where all those chatlogs and Celty pad signs were TSed… It did a lot for the immersion.

    A shame that they disbanded.

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    • Oh, you mean that group named SGKK that stalled the show after episode 4, because apparently it was too much for them?

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14. Now I hate Kristen as much as any sensible person hates an arrogant hypocrite moron who pretends to be a girl on internet but, all these comments about Coalgirls’ DRR, don’t you guys think it’s a bit pathetic to just paraphrase Xythar’s snarky tweets here?
    And when did Vivid standard of quality was whether or not Coalgirls did something?
    No, fuck you I’m not defending Kristen.

    P.S. Now we wait for Kristen to say something even more fucking stupid than he already said.

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    • Um what?

      The chat’s not important. Case closed.

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      • TS is not important, subbing a simulcast show is not important. If you’re going to do it anyway don’t half-ass it.

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        • I go with simul edits because the group fixes CR/FUNi’s tl errors, for what it’s worth. (unless the group sucks and doesn’t actually have a tlc or tlc sucks, but I’d probably still go with them anyway just because ts, non-shitty encode, OP/ED etc, but those things aren’t actually important and I’m just a fag who requires those things)
          Being able to fully understand the story and all its details is kinda important to me. Can’t speak for other people. Also, coalgirls’s DRR was BD, so yeah, I damn well expect everything tsed and tsed /well/.

          Though this is obvious bait and I’m just wasting my time.

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          • So you actually think Vivid will TS those logs for a BD release?
            HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
            That was a good one

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            • You are making a fool out of yourself.

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              • Bottom line is Vivid won’t fix that or admit they’re just too lazy to do it.

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                • Admitting that it is useless to do them is pretty much the same thing. I think you are behind with the facts.

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            • I don’t expect Vivid to do BDs for this show, so no.
              The signs are also spoken so I also don’t see a reason to do them in the first place. IIRC, D_S said the signs in the first DRR were actually important and required to be tsed or you’ll miss out on plot points because they weren’t spoken.

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15. Can someone please explain me what the hell is the point of typesetting such an effort sign which would take quite a long time to make it look decent while it is already being said during the scene?

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    • It makes for a higher quality release that gives people further reason to watch this over a simulcast script.

      I mean, I agree that it’s a huge amount of effort for a very small benefit in this case and probably isn’t worth doing if your typesetter doesn’t have the time, but I can at least see the argument for it. It certainly would be nice if they were properly typeset. I wouldn’t be up in arms demanding it though.

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      • Spending hours for such a small benefit isn’t efficient imo. Furthermore, it may cause totally unnecessary delays and it would just wear out the typesetter.

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      • It would be more beneficial on a BD release, but I don’t really see any point in doing it for a weekly series, which may even lead to further delays.

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    • This is the bed that fansubbing typesetters have made. Because some typesetters have aimed at ‘perfection’ regardless of whether the signs are important or not for typesetting, there’s a crowd of people who now expect that same perfection on every show.

      I personally don’t see the point in typesetting non-essential signs, but then I am considered ‘the old guard’ nowadays.

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      • I guess I have to agree you on that.

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    • See, here’s the thing. If you had a choice of getting those subs typeset or not, all else equal, would you? The answers are either “yes” or “I don’t care”. I have yet to see anybody say they don’t want those signs typeset.

      Is there the technology to typeset those signs? Yes.

      Are there the resources to typeset those signs? Yes, though it would put more work on the typesetter and delay the release.

      Honestly, the only reason why the signs are not typeset, outside of laziness, is the desire to release closer to airing time. But this is what you have to expect out of speedsubs.

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      • “I have yet to see anybody say they don’t want those signs typeset.”

        Well, this´ll be a first for you, then!

        Having unnecessary typesetting can actually be quite annoying. Many times I stop the video because I see a sing that might be “important” and I wasn´t able to read it in the allocated time. How do you call it? “It breaks the immersion”?

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      • Yes, given sufficient amount of time and effort those signs can be typeset, but is it worth to spend that time and effort so that people can say “Oh, these signs are typeset”? I mean, most of the people won’t bother reading the signs since the dialogue is hell a lot easier to follow. So the typesetter should spend hours just so that people can say “Oh, it’s there”? It’s pretty dumb imo.

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      • Considering that most people wouldn’t even have looked at those signs because they would be reading the subtitles at the same time, it’s wasted time and effort for a speedsub. These type of signs are better off on a BD release, when you have all the time you want to spend on them.

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        • Agreed, if they are gonna be typeset at all, it should be for BD release. While a weekly release would look nice with it, it’s not worth it as everyone has pointed out, and it gives one more reason to grab the BD version when it releases.

          Also, doing it for both TV and BD would be even more strenuous, because you’d basically have to do them twice as just a simple shifting of timing doesn’t always cut it.

          And it’s not about reading the actual signs, it’s about the fansub looking clean and well done. As long as you see huge Japanese text all over the screen, you immediately lose immersement and wonder why a fansub group as elite as Vivid couldn’t/wouldn’t do them.

          Granted, it’s a lot of effort, don’t wanna delay TV releases, fair point. But for the BD release it would be nice if they went the extra mile and did them, I for one would be pleased with it, but yes, it’s still something one can live without.

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          • I hardly see how a reminder that the show is actually Japanese by having a few Japanese kanji onscreen breaks any immersion, considering the audio is in Japanese! :D

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            • Add that on top of the fact that you either read the signs or the subtitles. It is humanly impossible to do both at the same time. Either way, no immersion is broken lol

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      • Which is where the concept of the group comes into play. Vivid is a speedsub group. They do what is prudent and ignore what would make the release better. I don’t blame them at all for it, I think if that’s their goal, all the power to them. But a group focused on quality would have had those signs typeset.

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        • So you guys at CoalGirls don’t strive for the highest quality? How come many of your shows don’t have decent typesetting? Kristen, it’s true Vivid could have done those signs, but it’s nothing necessary. They usually never miss relevant signs, and the overall quality is very good.

          Will you guys at CGi do the BDs for this show? If so, you better keep up with your claims.

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          • So Googol, can you tell me why you added memes to Commie’s Twintails?

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            • You should ask fnord.

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              • Then you should ask Cyras about CGi’s Durarara.

                Am I personally going to do this? No, I don’t like the show. But if I was, I’d get those signs TS’d as I never run away from the hardest challenge in the show. That’s why I got someone to fix and shake all the Monogatari signs, and restyled them to match other seasons. That’s why I made about 30 karaokes for Macross Frontier. And that’s why if I did this, I’d get those signs TS’d. But alas, I don’t like the show so you’ll have to do.

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                • Then you should not speak of a group in general either. Instead of saying “Vivid doesn’t care about quality, Vivid is lazy”, shouldn’t you only pick on unanimated? :/

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                  • With CGi, I had nothing to do with Cyras’s Durarara. We never do. If Cyras decided to stop doing it, it would’ve been dropped. Parts are simply not interchangeable, as CGi is not a group. We are simply a few people who release BDs according to rules set forth in the about page.

                    Vivid, however, is a group. They do (or can) have multiple typesetters to work on releases. So if unanimated could not do it or did not want to, they could easily bring in another typesetter to do it. Just like if a TL goes on vacation for a week, they can have a replacement TL fill in.

                    So no, saying Vivid is lazy is appropriate.

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                    • I simply can’t wrap my mind around how you can always find a reason you’re never at fault, yet others that do similar or the same things are guilty of a heinous crime.

                    • Don’t try Anon. It’s above your brainpower to understand what the adults are saying.

                    • >CGi is not a group. We are simply a few people who release BDs according to rules set forth in the about page.

                      Wow. This is beyond mental gymnastics.

                      “Mental contortionism,” perhaps?

                    • http://puu.sh/eVVcP/8899356da0.jpg FFF TV
                      http://puu.sh/eVVjz/63a74b0fc8.jpg CGI BD

                      http://puu.sh/eVWep/ec31248e7c.jpg FFF TV
                      http://puu.sh/eVWi5/3c37728e17.jpg CGI BD
                      http://puu.sh/eVWs1/785134d686.jpg CGI BD (last frame)

                      Eien fucked up colours for the “Episode” Part but BDs are supposed to be true QUALITY.

                      http://puu.sh/eVXqt/c8e24c7847.jpg FFF TV
                      http://puu.sh/eVXu9/f3aec96087.jpg CGI BD

                      Why is this line an8’d????? (same at 14:05 and a couple other sections)

                      I didn’t bother to check more, but it’s clear that CGi/Kristen doesn’t care about quality because CGi/Kristen is lazy.

                    • >windows
                      >mirc
                      >utorrent
                      No wonder fansubs are shit

                    • >Lyrics not updated to officials in the first few episodes
                      > Eyecatch/Part B chapters missing

                      I see there was a lot of effort put into that release.

                    • Oh, archdeco, you decided to grace us with your presence after stealing enough money to buy a new computer and run away from the scene. Congrats!

                      Question, if I was lazy, would I have changed those signs at all? No, they would have been exactly the same. However, I redid them using the same tags and fonts from UTW’s season 1. In addition, you’ll probably notice that a large number of scenes were substantially edited to reflect the exact lines that were stated in UTW’s release.
                      Did I miss a few? Possibly. Did the typesetting match up as well? No, not really. But it was consistent, and that was my goal. You can call the work crappy if you want, that’s your prerogative – and you would have called it crappy no matter what I did on it. But calling it a lazy effort is just wrong.

                      Also, part B chapters are stupid. I have never made part B in any release, ever. Chapters are designed to skip over certain parts such as OPs and EDs, not to just be there to look pretty.

                    • What the fuck are you talking about, archedeco? Kristen is never wrong! And when he is, it´s either another guy´s fault or “insert Kristen´s psycho reasoning”!

                      EDIT: See example of “Kirsten´s psycho reasoning” above.

                    • http://puu.sh/eW4AV/b0d3cea34a.png

                      Also, the goal of a typesetter is to match the japanese text, not the opposite.

                    • >run away from the scene

                      More baseless claims from Kristen. What a surprise.

                    • Yes archdeco. But the people I was talking about don’t take the money and run. They continue fansubbing and contributing to the community.

                    • Dude how the hell is that typesetting fine? Afaik, you have been in the scene for years now, even you should be able to tell that those signs just suck fucking donkey balls.

          • Yeah, CGi’s DRRR had a weird typesetting.

            [retrieved from offtopic v6] http://prntscr.com/4kr2sl

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            • >Expecting good typesetting from coalgirls

              i.imgur.com/yWEPbjG.png

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              • what the…

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                • never mind, looks like it is a problem on my end…

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      • I usually have quite high standards when it comes to typesetting, but you’re conveniently ignoring time constraints here. Most typesetters have a life outside of fansubbing and can’t (and probably don’t want to) spend all day on it. Not finishing an episode in a few hours may result in days of delay, not just the x more hours it takes to finish the job. Then at some point you have to ask yourself why you are doing premium subs on shitty TV video and not just do the BD instead. However, some people want their release to be relevant when the show airs and we all know that stuff not running on a tight schedule never gets finished.

        Regarding the technology to TS those signs: as it so happens, the guy who typeset this release is one among the very few people who actually contribute to the development of TSing tools – and yet he obviously deemed the effort required to get this done in time to be unreasonable. So either you are overestimating the current state of typesetting technology or Chihiro should come forward and release their awesome tools that allow you to do great TSing in a reasonable time frame.

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        • Oh trust me, I know. But even a day extra for those signs I think would be acceptable. And worth it, tbh, to stop all the questions of why they wouldn’t do it, and create a better product. After all, they say they like the show, so shouldn’t they be doing everything in their power to make sure it is the best it can be instead of something that can be better?

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          • Then you can spend the day doing that TS. Release a v2 for them or do it for chihiro. Apparently this is a big thing for you.

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            • Too bad that I don’t run Chihiro nor typeset.

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              • Never ran out of excuses, I see. That’s Kristen for you.

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          • No matter how much time you invest, the result is never going to be perfect while there’s an ever increasing amount of effort required to achieve diminishing improvements (pareto principle). At some point you need to make a cut-off or there will never be a release. When exactly that point is is subject to debate, but you can’t expect a group to sacrifice their lives for Drrr just because they happen to like the show. After all, people have needs and interests that go beyond obsessing about one particular thing (though i can see how that concept might be foreign to you).

            And even though Vivid didn’t care enough to give this show *great/exceptional* typesetting, judging by the total absence of other releases, they obviously care a lot more than either of us.

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16. But it’s absurd.

    unanimated, one of the key guys involved in the whole reason leechers even know what typesetting is, is somehow lazy because he didn’t typeset signs you wanted typeset, yet you aren’t lazy, because you can’t even manage a BD group, let alone a speedsub group. Or even read his guides so you can typeset something you want?

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    • An American football team is a set of players. The offensive line makes the quarterback better by buying him time to throw the ball. The running back makes the passing game better by making the other team respect the run. The throwing game makes the running game better by setting the linebackers further back and causing more blitzes. Every person helps each other, and the weakness of one player is the weakness of the team. Everybody is responsible for how the team does.

      A swim team consists of individual players. They are placed in individual lanes, and each get an individual time. The performance of each individual has no impact on the others. Just because person a swims fast doesn’t mean person b will do any better, outside of maybe feeling motivated. The individual is solely responsible for how good they do.

      So it is between Vivid and CGi.

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      • You’re bitching about typesetting on a review site and yet apparently can’t even open aegisub to notice your 1080p blur is off on a BD release. You know, that thing everyone archives because it’s supposed to be super amazing quality, but are not lazy because yes.

        unanimated actually created tools that started this whole crazy ‘omg a sign on screen for 2 seconds that is even mentioned in dialogue isn’t ts’d and also the font is off’ didn’t TS a sign you deem important but is lazy because you hate xythar or some shit.

        Sorry I’m not too good with colorful imagery.

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        • I’m sorry. Nobody has ever mentioned the 1080p blur before. So I’m glad you found something to nitpick about. Please enjoy downloading your other releases for reasons that are not visible to the audience except in comparisons. :)

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          • It figures you don’t know but blur is incredibly easy to spot when off.

            And it’s okay. You just don’t care enough about your shows to even look over releases. That’s why encoding errors are spotted in your comments section and not during QC.

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      • Why not put it the other way? “I don’t like Vivid because Xythar is in it.”

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17. Crunchyroll right after premiere or fansub… CR ofc.
    Who would bother waiting?

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    • I simply don’t have time to watch simulcasts on time. I’m always late by a few days anyway, at which point fansub releases are readily available. See? I’m pretty sure I’m not the only one.

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18. So is half the episode just shitty smart phone screens or something?

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    • Yes.

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19. I think it would take a special kind of dedicated to sacrifice one’s ability to even grip a pencil ten years down the line just so people on the internet have one less thing to bitch about this week.

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    • How dramatic.

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      • IfI this were about any other typesetter, maybe. But in this particular situation it’s 100% reality, whether you choose to actually read what was posted earlier or not.

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        • So if unanimated had typeset the chat he would cripple himself? And you’re saying that is not at all dramatic?
          OK

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          • Have fun typesetting all those signs. Be sure to post pics of your hand afterward.

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          • You probably have no idea of how typesetting is done at all. It’s not automagically done by pressing three buttons.

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            • Well I read all his guides on typesetting and I don’t remember saying it was easy BUT it still dramatic to say he would cripple himself doing if he had to.

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              • It’s just a bit of exaggeration from Xythar. Like, “if you try to jog 100 miles a day for this whole week, you’ll end up in a wheelchair.”, which is might be true in some cases. He could just put it in a much simpler way like “not worth it”.

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20. Kristen better hope Chihiro or CGi never miss a sign again, or he’ll never hear the end of it!

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