This post was written by Dark_Sage. He is Dark_Sage.
And here one review is. gg up next.
Table of Contents
Release Information
Episode details.
Release format: MKV (309 MB, 10-bit)
Japanesiness: Honorifics.
English style: American English.
Encoding details: http://pastebin.com/5kLV0qV4
Speed: Quick (<48 hours)
External links.
Group websites: http://rorisubs.com/ http://utw.me/
IRC channels: #[email protected] #[email protected]
SubCompare screenshot comparisons: http://www.subcompare.com/chuunibyou_demo_koi_ga_shitai!/
Commie’s fansub reviews: http://notredreviews.wordpress.com/autumn-2012-reviews/#chuuni
Visual Review
Karaoke.
The OP starts off like this. Really fucking basic, almost awkwardly simple. But prepare yourself for a seizure cuz it’s fucking coming.
And here you go. This is how the OP goes. Good fucking luck trying to read any goddamn thing.
That simplistic style before makes a whole lot more sense with this, but even then it’s fucking unreadable.
I’m a bit conflicted here thogh. It’s definitely awesome from an artistic perspective; the karaoke matches the opening naturally. But if karaoke is intended to provide a visually entertaining translation for the viewers, this struggles to succeed as it’s near impossible to read. You won’t be using this for the singing-along function of karaoke at all.
Me, I like to read the subs. But if you don’t give a damn about that, or if you can’t because you’re illiterate, I think you’ll definitely enjoy the OP.
Rating: Bad.
At least the ED was done right. Text bounces around to mimic the credits and background, and it fits damn well. The beginning effect was cool too. Unfortunately the script gets in the way of the credits sometimes, but it’s not a huge issue.
Rating: Great.
Typesetting.
It’s translated, the font matches, and it’s readable. Success.
I’m not really going to go into detail with any of these because typesetting is pretty binary to me. If it works, it works. If not, it will be obvious.
Original on top.
Same deal.
Would this have been so hard to typeset?
Script Review
Karaoke.
I had to demux the fucking script to read the karaoke. You can imagine how pleased I was. And then when I was trying to read from the script, I realized this wasn’t gonna fucking work. So I had to frame-by-frame the OP and find out it was not QC’d at all. NOT FUCKING HAPPY.
I found the fuck-ups in how the script looked on the screen, but for the script itself, I have no clue. What, am I supposed to assume that the script which I can’t read is good? That it fits the OP? Are the viewers? This was practically a waste of a translation.
This is pretty much nonsense.
And more nonsense. fotc, you’re usually on the ball with these things. How the fuck does the Sun getting full of emotion turn into that fucked up second line?
Main Script.
She says “Getto dase!” here.
A cute line requires an appropriately cute translation and this fits perfectly.
I’m gonna keep going on about this because it’s important. Curt lines play an important part in the conversation style of this anime. So the shorter the responses are for the sections where it’s emphasized in the show, the better.
For example, though “That’s not happening.” and “Not happening.” mean nearly the same thing, the first option would be definitively worse than what was done here because it unnecessarily adds an extra syllable to a line meant to be short, impacting the intended flow of the show.
URW’s doing a good job here.
You can tell a bad translation by its stock phrases. Almost immediately, you can tell if a group is phoning it in or not (baka -> idiot, shikataganai -> it can’t be helped, etc.). Here, URW went with “Stop that!” as a translation for “Urusai” rather than the standard “Shut up!”
This may not be something you even consciously think about, but it’s definitely the kind of thing that helps spur along the vibrancy of the show. It’s these small things that add up and create releases worth watching.
Love it. For my non-native readers, “No means no.” is an anti-date rape slogan here in the US (maybe elsewhere too). You may think that kind of thing would lead to a serious interpretation here, but that’s rarely how it goes down when people use it in conversation. There’s often a joking context behind it even though the joke is like… you’re trying not to be raped. Hmm, explaining culture is hard.
Point is the line fits in damn well here.
Note: The reason why you’re seeing so much praise here is because I’m going line by line on this release. The Chuu2 reviews are apparently my most-anticipated ones, so I’m going to make damn sure you get a comprehensive look at what I think of the overall releases that’s not always needed on other shows.
While knowing when to keep lines short is important, the overall message is to make translations match the Japanese in length whenever possible. Here, the line needs an extension to fit the scene better.
Try, “Yuuta, you’re so mean.” since she says his name. Another three syllables would fit perfectly.
More important than matching line length is getting characters down. There is some wiggle room in character interpretation, even though the thought must greatly offend purists, but the most important part is making the characters stand out in a way that makes sense. True, most of the work is done by the anime and the voices. But the subs need to match that to provide a quality viewer experience.
And here, URW matched the scene well.
More length matching talk.
In Japanese here, there’s a notable pause halfway through the line then it completes. However, the English here is heavily weighted toward the first part, with very little for the finish. This does create an inconsistency with the user experience because one generally reads the subtitles along with the voice.
And this is also a point where it’s important to note that you can’t always have your tiramisu and eat it too. Keeping the translation similar while matching her tone of voice and managing to match her mid-sentence pause is difficult to manage here. While not ideal, leaving the line as-is is likely the best option.
If these perfume brands are a reference to something, I’m missing out.
When you’re asking the question, “Is this a literal translation (because the anime’s good) or a clever one from the group?” it means good things for a release. Because at that point you’re fully engaged as a viewer – which is one of the most important things a subtitle can do.
It’s important to draw the distinction between clever writing and overreaction. This line feels a bit too strong for the situation even though the guy’s freaking out on the floor.
“No! Simulation failed!” would refer back to the original “simulation” that got him into this position on the floor in the first place. It’s also less severe of a reaction.
And yes, I get that “I’ll die” isn’t literal, but the line doesn’t fit.
The fuck? How do you unlock a magic code? Not good.
That doesn’t make sense. Whoever wrote the second line doesn’t fucking know what “inundate” means. I bet they were thinking of “Initiating”, which would also be off, but not as wrong. A better line would be:
“Activating anti-radiation shield!”
<fotc> By the way, the thing about the anti-radiation shield. They actually say “inject water into shield”. This action makes sense because water has a halving depth of 20 cm, so only 3% radiation breaks through 1m of water.
<fotc> I called up a nuclear science friend of mine, who said that “inundate” was fine by him.
<fotc> Though on second thought, “flood” would have been better.
<Dark_Sage> Works for me. I’ll edit that in. Thanks for the correction; I don’t know much about nuclear energy.
<fotc> Thanks.
<fotc> It’s pretty interesting, actually. Water is one of the best radiation shields in the universe.
<fotc> And the cheapest.
So, not an issue.
Too lengthy. Drop the “about this” part and it’ll fit nicely.
Nothing wrong with playing with English. For those who don’t get it, capitalization in this specific way means the person in question is being referred to as “God”. So he’s basically saying he’s a god. Fun stuff.
More lines I liked. Each fit the given scene very well.
There’s no pause that requires this to be split into two sentences.
“Maybe in your head you did.”
Results
Watchability: Quite watchable.
Visual grade: B
Script grade: B+
Overall grade: B+
An altogether decent release that I have a bit of issue with because the OP doesn’t match what I believe OPs should provide. So let’s talk about karaoke.
OP/ED factor in for when I choose a group, but I asked a sampling of people on #whine-subs what they thought, to better gauge how to make these reviews more relevant to you.
<Xythar> i wouldn’t choose a release based on the karaoke
<Xythar> it’s nice to have, but it’s never decisive
<&Dark_Sage> Would a release with unreadable karaoke factor in?
<+Minami_> I turn it off if it’s bad
<+Minami_> but I don’t stop watching that group
<Shirt> I hardly ever watch OP/EDs
<SoupRKnowva> kara is a silly waste of time methinks…so no, i dont let it factor it at all
So what I get from that is OP/ED shouldn’t heavily impact a group’s final score. I’d like your thoughts down below too because those replies were all from fansubbers’ perspectives.
why do u have to extract the script to read op kara? why not simply use pause(space key)?
Have you watched this release? Try factoring in the Japanese voice, the visuals, and both lines of subtitles all at once as the visual part flashes in and out every 3 frames while the vocals remain steady. It’s not all that easy.
Use the ctrl key in MPC to advance frame by frame.
Also Dark, I think you’re forgetting that about half of the op is very readable. There are portions where I had to put the text above into the white borders because there was no place for it anywhere else. Those lines and a couple others which stay on the screen for more than a few seconds are readable. This review makes it seem like the entire karaoke is seizure-tastic. Don’t think you’re being very fair here.
The bleeding errors were due to ep 2 being improperly shifted by other staff and nobody catching the error. Sutai assured me that “it doesn’t matter because nobody watches the OP after ep 1” but he’s wrong, as usual.
Next week I supervise personally OP and ED shifting.
>http://crymore.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/URW_Chuunibyou_demo_Koi_ga_Shitai_-_02_720pEB39C0D3.mkv_snapshot_01.17_2012.10.13_02.04.35.jpg
sasuga
I’d like to point out that the OP for ep 2 was shifted improperly, causing a couple of bleeds.
You can bet I was pretty mad about it.
I worked too hard on this damn thing to have it ruined by simple shifting errors.
Next week I shift everything myself.
If you want something done correctly, you have to it yourself.
On the karaoke issue, unless I really like the OP/ED, I usually skip them. I do think that the karaoke affects first impressions of a release, but other than that, it shouldn’t factor too much since I’m sure not everyone watches the OP/ED every episode for every series.
Stop posting here and go finish UmiTweak.
Sorry, that’s a different person.
I read the OP/ED translations the first time I’m watching – after that I just listen to the music or skip the intro.
Don’t really care for the KFX or styling as long as it isn’t a normal dialogue font.
(Note: One more fansubber perspective.)
And for those who are wondering, here’s URW’s OP translation:
That moment there, when we were looking eye-to-eye,
Before you looked away, what was going through your head?
I want to know
You’ll look this way
and see me pouting with a frown ❤
Ask me if there’s something wrong,
I’m waiting for you to
That’s all I really want ❤
The thing that I said to myself
after “Nothing” was
way too embarrassing ❤
So say you didn’t hear
A love so strong you just can’t stop it
Pulling two into one
It’s already started for us now ❤
I’ve seen you in plenty of my dreams,
But I still want to see you when I’m awake
You made me feel this way
When you’re in love, you want to have it all
Let’s go wherever our hearts want to go ❤
They beat so hard that they could explode
All of my dreams and ideals and fantasies
All of them for a whole new world
Where everything revolves around you
Karaoke… depends on quality of OP&ED and the show, sometimes I want to skip OP/ED even if they’re good, in other cases I watch even if they’re merely OK. Slightly lowering importance of karaoke in grading system might be a good idea.
I’m not the kind of person that skips OPs and EDs — I only rarely do so for especially terrible ones — but I don’t read the karaoke either. I use that time to do other things and just listen to the Japanese usually; it’s really not important at all in my opinion. It barely even makes sense most of the time (but that’s not the translation’s fault) and it shouldn’t factor into the score of the release as it is irrelevant to the show itself.
If it’s a choise between 2 shows the one that did karoake wins.
>She says “Getto dase!” here.
Actually, it’s “Getto daze!”. Small difference.
And it’s a reference to Pokemon. It’s what Ash says in the Japanese version when he catches a Pokemon.
Why didn’t you episode 1? Kinda shady Dark_Sage.
Tell ya what, why don’t you tell me why I didn’t do episode 1?
I don’t know, perhaps you got a tip that URW’s episode 1 wasn’t quite up to par and they much improved in episode 2? clearly Daiz has something to do with this conspiracy.
That’s the conspiracy? Yeah, if someone tells me a release isn’t up to snuff, I won’t review it. I instituted that policy last season and have followed every request from every group who asked me to hold off.
http://crymore.net/2012/06/18/a-whiners-pro-primer/
Scroll down to Episode Requests. Of course, no one ever asked on the Review Queue, so it wasn’t as open as I was hoping for, but I have logs of said requests if you absolutely want to audit me. (Please don’t. It’ll take a lot of time.)
Actually, if you think transparency is an issue, it’s likely that others will too. Maybe an audit post would be a good idea.
If I were to do one, what would you like to see in it?
I don’t think transparency is an issue overall, I’ve just heard passing rumors that Raze has taken an issue with Jaka’s comments about their release(s). Don’t inconvenience yourself over my gullibility; I blame LoL’s World championship.
I wouldn’t say you’re gullible. It was a fair point. I did choose to review episode 2 based on a group’s misgivings about their first release. If you didn’t have the context behind me finding it acceptable to request no-reviews, then it would seem to be a significant issue.
Thank you for your willingness to call me out on it. Keeping me honest is an important part of keeping this site relevant.
Well damn, I’m now feeling particularly stupid. I’ve been following your reviews for quite some time and do appreciate them but somehow I must have missed that post.
Well, their episode 1 was pretty shitty, but that doesn’t mean Dark_Sage still wouldn’t give them a good score because >UTW and gg a bad score because >gg.
tl;dr it was rigged regardless of which episode
I sure do love UTW unconditionally.
http://crymore.net/2012/05/18/fansub-review-utw-accel-world-episode-04/
http://crymore.net/2012/07/21/fansub-review-utwoots-sword-art-online-episode-02/
http://crymore.net/2011/07/17/fansub-review-utw-kamisama-no-memochou-episode-02/
http://crymore.net/2011/04/04/fansub-review-utw-mazui-steinsgate/
And I hate on gg, always.
http://crymore.net/2012/07/06/fansub-review-gg-binbougami-ga-episode-01/
http://crymore.net/2011/04/09/fansub-review-gg-dororon-enma-kun-meramera/
Look, you’re right that I don’t like gg very much. But let’s not pretend it isn’t because gg’s releases tend to suck. I post every screenshot I have an issue with and explain each problem. If you think I’m wrong, go ahead and refute me. It’s fucking easy. You take a line I had an issue with, explain why it isn’t an issue, and bam! My point is then invalidated and you can get off on showing me up.
The reason why you don’t do this, of course, is because you can’t. So you throw around snide remarks like “Oh, D_S is just biased.” and ignore reality.
Really, if I’m so biased, prove it. Put up or shut up. In before an “I was just joking.” backtrack.
Sorry, Xythar has informed me it is fotc you have a boner for. Like with the Kokoro Connect review. “These lines don’t make sense, but he explained it to me, so np.” Maybe you just forgot the entire point of the review is to simulate what the average viewer would get, not someone who can ask the translator to clarify the line.
p.s. http://www.ffst.hr/~berislav/phed/site%20filozofija/witt/t7en.html
Also I can’t refute because you don’t take screenshots of what most people would consider bad lines because you don’t think they’re bad.
I’m not going to call out lines as bad if someone tells me I fucked up my interpretation. What the fuck are you even arguing? That I should obstinately refuse to correct myself when I’m wrong? Goddamn, that’s a stupid idea.
Also, why not show me what “most people” would consider bad lines in this release? You have your own review site; I’d love to see it.
Your interpretations weren’t wrong; the subs were ambiguously worded (more like not edited). My point was you didn’t deduct any points from their grade because you could ask the translator what the fuck the line meant but you don’t do this for anyone else.
Also, I probably will, but I think I’ll review a later episode since both of us doing the same is kind of dumb.
Well, I could ask him, just like I could ask anyone else. But I didn’t. Occasionally I do ask for clarification on things from groups when I’m unfamiliar with the source material. But I don’t see that as being an issue. Is knowledge bad or something?
As for your charge that I’m apparently conspiring with fotc to make whatever he touches turn to review grade gold, the only thing we ever talk about in regards to these reviews is the OP/ED translations, because that subject interests the both of us. And that’s only after I post them; not before. Sometimes I interpret lines wrong; sometimes they’re legitimate mistakes.
He did mention on this review that I got the inundate part wrong, so I removed that as an error. But Xythar mentioned they got another part of the show wrong which I marked you down for as wrong, so I added that as an error. 1:1 trade. Such bias.
If it bugs you so much that I’m friends with fotc, you need to take a step back and calm the fuck down. You’re seeing conspiracies where none exist and it’s getting pathetic.
Uh, you definitely got him to clarify a bunch of shit in your Kokoro Connect review. The fuck are you talking about.
As long as it’s not totally unreadable, using the Aegisubs default style, or a rainbow karaoke; no, it shouldn’t drastically affect the final score.
I, personally, found URW’s OP karaoke utterly amusing – it’s J-POP lyrics after all so nothing of value is lost :V
Speaking for myself here, I extremely encourage artistically and cleverly made karaoke–especially when they fit the OP/ED sequence perfectly just like in URW case. That could be because they show me how much effort the fansubber has put into making them.
In this case, I chose “artistic” over “eminently readable”. This is the way KyoAni did the OP. That informed me on how I should do the karaoke. After watching this OP, I felt i had received a letter from them telling me “this is how you should do it.” That’s how clear it was to me.
The answer is in the credits. Even the credits are so “seizure-tastic”, so the creators of the show must not place great importance in you being able to read them. They sacrificed readability for art. Why should the song translation and lyrics be more important than the names of the people who made the show? I merely treated the song in the same manner the credits were treated.
I don’t regret my decision.
Sorry you don’t like it, Dark.
Glad you like the ED, though. I put a lot of time into that one.
I watch the OP/ED once. If I actually like the song (tall order there, they’re usually Engrish and/or horrible) I will listen to it again, but I won’t actually watch it. I did watch the OP for this release and thought it was awful. Blinking lyrics? No thanks.
Kara doesn’t mean jack when I’m deciding which release to watch, though. I think it shouldn’t influence the final grade that much.
i typically watch the op/ed for the first, skip them for the other, and watch them again for the last episode to wrap up the anime. while karaoke is nice to look at, i honestly don’t read them since i rather focus all my attention on the op/ed animation instead. but if i’m deciding between fansubs that have equally good translations, typesetting, etc., then the one with the better karaoke wins.
As a dude is a viewer only and not a fansubber at all, unless I really REALLY like the song I almost always skip right past the OP and ED. And in the rare case where I do watch it, I’m doing so to listen to the song and do not give a shit what the kara looks like on screen. I doubt I’d even notice if everyone stopped doing kara altogether to be honest.
If I really like the song, I’ll watch the karaoke because I’ll actually be interested in the words and want to make sure I’m hearing it correctly. But that’s somewhat rare. Most shows, past the first episode, I’ll simply listen to the OP/ED with the video minimized while I do something else.
Kara is not important at all.
I skip the OP/ED 95% of the time, so karaoke usually never matters to me.
Kara only makes a difference to me if the groups doing a show are all pro-sub edits. Since the scripts will be 90% the same, I’ll get the one with the nicer kara.
I usually only watch the OP/ED properly once to see if the song fits the show, I might watch some of the better animated ones again, but the karaoke never really factors in for me. I think as long as it’s translated at the very least, just to see if what is being sung is relevant to the series. But still it’s not like the lack of karaoke has a significant impact on the enjoyment of a series for me.
Although if the OP/ED changed with every episode, animation wise and lyrically, then I would say the karaoke, or at least the translation of the OP/ED would be important enough to affect the grade.
Or better still, maybe you should make a separate karaoke grade that doesn’t affect the overall grade. Then just maybe note relevance of the karaoke for a series that did have a unique OP/ED.
I think card sucks at making kara that doesn’t break.
I think card sucks at making kara.
I think card could add more blur to her kara.
I think anyone from Commie making any remarks about karaoke quality is hilarious, seeing as they either never do karaoke and what little they do is always awful.
Because karaoke is shit. I mean you, a master of karaoke, can’t even make good karaoke. What does that say?
That’s the first time I’ve seen an either-and clause.
Xythar, I just invented it right now, by pressing delete a few times and retyping in the wrong conjunction.
And you were here to see it! The invention of a new clause!
Remember this day so you can one day tell your grandchildren about it.
I think karaoke should still be part of the grade, but have lower emphasis.